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Balti
10-20-2008, 11:37 AM
I'm not going to use this forum to advance any political party or idea. Nor will I endorse a candidate for the upcoming election. Why am I typing a thread in a gaming forum about it? Well, we talk about everything else and I generally subscribe to the theory that you should not talk about politics or religion for fear that you will cause a flame war and I agree, that will be bad.

The purpose of this is just to talk about some ideas. I do not want anyone to flame another, I don't want anyone to endorse a candidate or a political party in this thread...anything remotely close to that will be deleted. That's the only warning I can give!

That being said, those of you that live in the US, go vote on November 4th. That is one right that hasn't been taken away from you yet and you need to exercise that right. Does it really matter who you vote for? Well, without supporting one party or another, that is our main problem. We are stuck in a process that only legitimately allows two parties to compete. There are a bunch more out there, but the two parties have made their own rules and regulations and therefore, that is what you get. That's your only true choice. You can vote 3rd party, or Mickey Mouse, but it does not matter in the end.

That, in my opinion, is one of the major problems facing any real change in the way things are run right now. There may be a few differences between the two main parties, but that is it. They generally agree on most issues and it is the extremes of both parties that push the envelope and create the "issues" each election year. This goes all the way back to the beginning...after George Washington that is. After the revolution, George Washington was the unanimous choice by all because everyone felt that he would be the only leader to hold our fragile union together after fighting for independence from England.

I read a lot. I took a lot of political science classes that were required for my major in college. I follow the news and elections very closely. All I listen to anymore on the radio is talk radio (they don't play my music anyways LOL). I read mostly (99% of the time) non-fiction books. I love history. After watching the HBO mini-series, "John Adams", I went out and bought the book by David McCullough. It is awesome, and as usual, the book is better than the movie. Don't worry my Canadian friends, I have two books I just bought recently about the history of Canada and other things too so that I can better educate myself! Since I read "John Adams" this summer, it put me on a "founding fathers binge," and a historical presidents binge. Since that one, I've read one on George Washington and Andrew Jackson. I have more to read about Jefferson, Polk, Franklin, Madison, and so on. I've become quite infatuated with historical books about the beginnings of our government, the founding fathers, and the infancy of our union.

That being said, in reading those books, I believe even more firmly in the idea that the federal government's only duty under the Constitution is to protect its' citizens. That's it. You can look at nearly every single issue and problem today in our country and attribute it to our government's intrusion on things other than that which our Constitution provides for. Should our federal government really have a Department of Education? Internal Revenue Service? United States Post Office? Federal Aviation Administration? I could go on and on with other examples.

Look at the current financial crisis. We hear a lot of bickering back and forth amongst the two candidates for President right now, the media, and other members of government on who is to blame. Is it really one person? Is it really one party? I don't think so. I think it is a large compilation of a lot of factors and the federal government in general is a big part of it. Regardless on where you stand on whether we should bail out the companies... we did, it is done. Your tax dollars are now being spent on the bail out. Will this bail out actually work? It may be a band aid on the current problem but it will not fix the overall problem according to most financial experts.

All I can say is to question EVERYTHING the federal government does. According to the founding fathers, they were scared of a powerful federal government and really tried to put that power into the individual states in the union. After all, should a national government decide what is best for the citizens of Vermont for example, or should Vermont itself decide that? It is my opinion that, again, the federal government should only be responsible for the protection of its' citizens. It can be argued all day and night what actually constitutes protection, but the LEAST amount of governmental intrusion on our daily lives the better in my opinion.

That being said, I truely believe that the only way our tax system is going to be fair is to totally dismantle it altogether right now. That's right...no Internal Revenue Service...no income tax...no death tax (what the hell is that anyway - we tax the dead so the dead's family can't have any wealth accumulated over a lifetime??? why do we stand for things like that?) In my opinion, the only true way to have a fair and balanced tax system is to have a national sales tax. 3 cents on every dollar spent on everything in this country other than food. Those who are poor/lower class would obviously spend less and therefore be taxed less then those who are wealthy. It is the only fair way to tax (a necessary evil to run a federal government).

Why did I type this anyways? I've been having a back and forth email conversation with another OSG member on this since no one wants politics in general on the forums. If we typed those messages on here, it would undoubtedly create a shit storm and would not be beneficial to anyone. In typing this thread, I'm trying to bring out ideas (party neutral ideas) and see what you guys actually think about things. Again, I do not want anyone endorsing a party or candidate here in this thread (it will get deleted - no matter how good or bad it is!). I just want to hear your thoughts on different topics in politics. Politics doesn't have to be ugly. Hell, you think the two parties we have now fight a lot? Take a look back at the beginning of this country and see how they fought then! LOL it was much worse!!

I have a really good eye-opening political book. I will not type who it is by, because that automatically makes it a party issue. This person is a member of a political party out of necessity since the two party system is what we are stuck with...pm/email me for a good recommendation - it is short and sweet for those of you that don't read much or don't have the time to read much. If anyone wants to talk about politics in general...please type in this thread.

If anyone wants to talk about the election, party politics, various candidates or whatever that would get deleted, feel free to send me a PM or an email. I love talking politics but I don't want to create a flame war here...we can do it off the site! :D

Balti
10-20-2008, 12:03 PM
Speaking of books, can anyone recommend a really good Abraham Lincoln book? I don't want one that has too much on the battles of the Civil War, but one that deals with his entire life, etc.

Also, can anyone recommend a good one for the Masons? One that isn't a conspiracy theory type?

Roo
10-20-2008, 01:40 PM
HOLY SMOKES!!!!! That's all I'm going to say. :)

chiselwac
10-20-2008, 05:42 PM
http://www.amazon.com/New-World-Order-Ancient-Societies/dp/0910311641

http://www.amazon.com/Malice-Toward-None-Abraham-Lincoln/dp/0060924713/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1224538960&sr=1-6

Whiskey_Corpse
10-20-2008, 06:43 PM
You run for presidnet next term and I will vote for you bro...could not of said that much information better my self

Bucko
10-20-2008, 07:24 PM
Here's some political fun.. See how your views line up with each candidate's policy:

www.glassbooth.org

SaskNewfie
10-20-2008, 07:39 PM
Here's some political fun.. See how your views line up with each candidate's policy:

www.glassbooth.org

Looks like I'm 73% Obama...I mean Harper!

Balti
10-20-2008, 11:14 PM
http://www.amazon.com/New-World-Order-Ancient-Societies/dp/0910311641

http://www.amazon.com/Malice-Toward-None-Abraham-Lincoln/dp/0060924713/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1224538960&sr=1-6

Thanks for the suggestions Chisel. The Lincoln book looks pretty good but the other one doesn't seem to be what I'm looking for. I just want to read about the Masons - that one looks like a religious zealot's idea of conspiracies!

DannieD
10-21-2008, 02:10 PM
Look for "The Illumanti: A secret society revealed, An ancient conspiracy unleashed"

Pongo647
10-21-2008, 02:24 PM
Damn, I'm a libertarian! We just had a 58% voter turnout, damned embarrassing for reasons already said by Balti. Pampered, spoiled citizens. Although, it's been close to that for 30 years anyway.

McFeely
10-22-2008, 12:26 PM
Balti great post and a good topic of discussion. Since you are on a history quest I would suggest you study the period between 1840 and 1860 leading to the Civil War. You will find that slavery was only one of the issues. There were many others involving state's rights and to what degree federal law should apply. I agree that the line today is more blurred than it was back then. As far as the current financial situation we are in, it is really history repeating itself. I direct you to the study previous financial panics most notably, the one of 1907. Faced with a possible collapse the financial market, the major banks provided for each other the reinforcement of bad decisions. In other words they bailed each other out. From this panic came the Federal Reserve System. I don't have time to write out a long thing like you. I read alot too and the current financial situation was probably summed up best in another book, The Godfather. When Michael asks Clemenza about how bad the next mob war is going to be. Clemenza replies "Pretty god damn bad. These things gotta happen every five years or so, ten years. Helps to get rid of the bad blood.". The market is a good buy now. There is blood in the streets and some companies are at the lowest in years. You have to be a long term buyer not a trader. Invest the DRIPs.

GOAT
10-22-2008, 05:41 PM
Balti I must say that you made that a very good read! But, I sure hope that your hands were clean because you just about took those words directly out of my mouth. We are presently in some deep doo doo and we need a miracle to get out of it and none of the parties has a candidate that in my opinion can answer to the name of a higher being so alas no miracles this time? Do we see another revolution coming? Maybe, but I don't think so! I wish Ya'll subscribed to these Veteran web sites that I do. Very eye opening and not a lot of BS either. Makes you really think a lot and oh yes, I love to read and I do a lot of it. I just hate politics! You can always tell when a politician is lying, his mouth is moving! End!